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Hip and Thigh: Smiting Theological Philistines with a Great Slaughter. Judges 15:8

Thursday, August 30, 2007

Bro. Cloud's Mailbox

TO: David Cloud
SUBJECT: Godly Music


Bro. Cloud,

I just want to thank you so much for your ministry, especially your website. As a Christian person who has just returned from being a backslidder, it certainly is a blessing. I walked an aisle and prayed a sinner's prayer when I was 13 years old, but lived the life of a carnal Christian until just recently and the Lord has used you to help me keep straight.

I really appreciate how you expose apostasy in the Church. One of the areas where you really helped me see apostate thinking even in my own Christian walk is with music. I used to think that CCM was godly, but you have shown me with your thorough citation of personal quotes from the mouths of CCM artists that they are worldly at heart because many of them say secular musicians have influenced their Christian music. Particularly eye-opening is how you may find quotes that are 20, maybe 30 years old, from such CCM performers as Larry Norman,2nd Chapter of Acts, and Dallas Holmes.

I was shocked to learn how this kind of apostasy has been around for so long even with that "calvinist" convert, Steve Camp. And I never knew that Steven Curtis Chapman recorded some of his songs at Abby Studios, the very studios where the Beatles recorded their music back in the 60s and 70s. I know he wasn't singing secular songs, but just being in those studios is allowing yourself to be associated with evil.

Well, you have taught me that fresh water cannot come out of salt water, so I burned all my CCM tapes and CDs.

I still liked music, so I replaced all my CCM with classical and Southern Gospel, but applying the principles of separation that I have learned from you, I had to burn all my classical and Southern Gospel tapes and CDs as well. That is because many of those composers like Vivaldi and Mozart were Roman Catholics, and that Bach fellow was Lutheran, and we both know how apostate those Lutheran folks are. And many of those Southern Gospel groups like the McGruders are Pentecostal or a part of that apostate Southern Baptist denomination.

So, for a long while I couldn't find any godly music to listen to, but recently the Lord has introduced me to the Glory Bugles. This is the God honoring music I have been looking for. Not only is their music style spiritual, but their lyrics are convicting. For instance, their song "Have you heard from Peter's rooster?" confronts personal compromise and secret, unconfessed sins. Then, another one of their songs "If your hair's too long (there's sin in your heart)" is direct and to the point I am sure you will agree. They also have songs about the only true Bible translation, the King James.

I thought I would pass along the Glory Bugles to you as well, Bro. Cloud. Maybe you could write one of your daily articles supporting them and telling everyone about really God fearing music?

Again, thanks for your website. It is so encouraging there are preachers out there, like yourself, who stand against the end-times apostasy and for the old Baptist paths.

In his grip,

Ronnie Bass

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10 Comments:

Blogger Mike-e said...

This is brilliant, Fred :-)

6:00 AM, August 30, 2007  
Blogger Hayden said...

Fred,

I kept wondering who "brother cloud" was when I read this article. So, I followed one of your links and snooped around. HILARIOUS! It is even funnier that this "heresy hunter" lives about an hour away from where I live.

What a great satirical piece! This is a good use of sarcasm. I am glad I did not have my coffee in hand as I read it.

Hayden

6:59 AM, August 30, 2007  
Blogger Fred Butler said...

Hayden,
You have to read my other two Bro. Cloud's Mailbox if you happened to like this one.

I encountered him way back when I was a KJV onlyist and subscribed to his O Timothy journal thing he publishes. I loved the KJV stuff, but I began to become uneasy with his brand of fundamentalism that was overly alarmist and in many cases, down right mean spirited and chasing windmills where none existed.

Any sound fundamentalist worth his salt knows bro. Cloud.

I am not sure he lives in the U.S., however. The last I heard, he was a church planter/missionary in Nepal. I remember hearing about that a couple of years ago, so he may be here in the states again.

Fred

7:15 AM, August 30, 2007  
Blogger Carl said...

I'm familiar with David Cloud's extremism and long since rejected his teachings.

With that said, I would love to see you post any response he makes, although I am not holding my breath.

10:02 AM, August 30, 2007  
Blogger Hayden said...

Fred,

I guess you are right! It looks like their PO Box is in Port Huron which is near me.

By the way, the other two posts were great as well. I remember the first one now that my memory has been refreshed. I have had the long hair discussion as well.

Hayden

2:12 PM, August 30, 2007  
Blogger Ransom said...

It's a mark of brilliant satire when you can read through it halfway before you start thinking it seems a little exaggerated . . .

2:36 PM, August 30, 2007  
Blogger The Vegas Art Guy said...

I knew something was wrong with the letter from the second paragraph when you mentioned apostacy, and the second alarm went off about the music, especially the bit about abbey rd studios

Very Very Clever...

The sad part is I've met people who have gotten rid of all their secular music simply because it was not 'Christian'. I can understand tossing some of it, but there is plenty of secular music that does not glorify sex, drug and rock n roll.

1:57 PM, September 04, 2007  
Blogger Kent Brandenburg said...

What makes something really funny is when it is based upon truth? I can't defend every method used by David Cloud or all of his positions, but you misrepresent several of them with your satire. Or perhaps no position can possibly be misrepresented by satire, which is the advantage of using it. If something is not based in truth, that makes it a what?

He's against easy prayerism, written many articles against it. He also doesn't believe that the KJV is the only true Bible translation.

You could perhaps help him with the context of some of his quotes with your examples.

11:06 PM, September 09, 2007  
Blogger Fred Butler said...

Kent,

One thing to note is that I am writing from the position of a David Cloud follower. You may think I am misrepresenting Mr. Cloud's ideas, but many of his followers I have encountered over the years think along the lines of my fictional emailers.

I keep regular tabs on his postings, particularly his Daily Article Listings in which he thinks he is serving the Church by presenting out-of-context information written in an hysterical, the-sky-is-falling style. Much of the things he points to as examples of end times apostasy is absurd and wildly exaggerated. He embarrasses not only himself, but the people of God.

Take for example his music material. I linked some of his articles in this post. He makes a big deal out of the fact many CCM artists listened to and were influenced by secular music at one time in their life. So, what? How does that influence impact the particular artists material now? And how exactly does it dishonor God? He never provides any examples.

Additionally, his illustrations of these wicked rock stars is like 30 years out of date. He is all the time quoting sources (out of context nearly 90 percent of the time) from articles published in the 1980s. I am sorry, but I have moved on from Mylon Lefevere and Dallas Holmes. Moreover, he levels a lot of ridiculous "guilty by association" accusations common among myopic fundamentalists. For example, the idea that Steven Curtis Chapman recorded some songs or an album at Abby Road studios, the same studio where the Beatles recorded their music, and that some how makes Chapman's music apostate, is profoundly stupid. The Beatles haven't recorded an album in like what? 35 years? Two of them are dead for crying out loud. Does Cloud think the "stinky voodoo" left over from the Beatles is going to rub of on Chapman and corrupt the minds of fine fundy Baptist youth? That's like saying no one can listen to Fred's preaching because he shopped at Gelson's Market in Studio City once and that's the same market where George Clooney shops occasionally and we all know how leftist he is.

But, the icing on the cake in my mind is where Cloud publishes documented error in his articles and refuses to be corrected when it is pointed out to him. Case in point. A couple of years ago he published some Daily Article critiquing Steve Camp's criticisms of CCM. In the bio information about Steve, he says how Steve is an elder at Grace Community Church. Steve was never an elder at GCC. He was asked by John in 1998 to head up a singles ministry out reach on Weds. He did this for about a year or so until all his family troubles came down on him and the elders at Grace released Steve to return to Nashville with his family to deal with his problems. I actually emailed Cloud to point out this misinformation and offered the more accurate facts and he berated me and refused to receive any correction. I didn't write him with hostility or anything, just to merely help him out with a factual mistake in his article and I get that kind of reaction? Unbelievable.

You may like the guy, but he is a blight on the Christian Church in my mind.

7:43 AM, September 10, 2007  
Blogger Kent Brandenburg said...

Like I said, I can't defend Cloud in everything that he does. You sound like you've read him more than I have. I have never received his paper, but read some of his articles on line. I have him linked at my website, because I believe he will help people---he goes after Jack Hyles, easy-believism, and more. He says the same things you guys would say about market-driven ministries. Everyone needs to judge what they read. He is attempting to keep people away from doctrinal and practical perversion. I imagine your big problem with him is the KJV issue and personal separation.

I recognize that he doesn't present the best or even valid arguments, and some of them seem hokie. If what you say is true, then he is flat wrong for not correcting his errors. Whoever does that should humble himself and fix his mistakes. Everyone should do that, even Douglas Kutilek. :-) Don't you think?

1:16 PM, September 12, 2007  

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