Hip and Thigh: Smiting Theological Philistines with a Great Slaughter. Judges 15:8

Sunday, September 24, 2006

I had my first Kirk Cameron sighting

On Labor Day I was at a get together with the family and I had one of our dear friends tell us excitedly how she spoke with Kirk Cameron, the former 80s TV sitcom star and teen idol and now Way of the Master host, at our church on Sunday. "He came up with his family to the Christmas in September table where I was sitting and asked where they go for membership." "Really," I said, "Kirk Cameron? No, foolin'?"

The next week when I went to church, I looked all over campus to see if I could spot him. I thought he would be fairly easy to spot being a genuine, recognizable TV personality, but he proved as elusive as Nessie.

The following week, I had two other friends on two separate occasions tell me of seeing Kirk Cameron at church. One older friend remarked, "He walked by our pew and I thought I recognized him as someone famous, but I couldn't remember who he was." I quipped, "I think he was that genius kid on Doogie Howzer, MD." "Oh yeah," stated my friend, "that's where I have seen him."

My friend isn't too keen on 80s TV sitcom stars.

The week after that, I had even more friends and co-workers talk about seeing Kirk. "Have you seen Kirk, yet?" the person would ask, "I think he is coming to our church now." "So I have heard," I would say.

"I saw Kirk over by the bookstore," stated one person.

"I saw Kirk and his kids by the fountain," another would claim.

"Kirk was over walking by the gym."

"Have you seen Kirk?"

Kirk Cameron was proving to be my snuffleupagus.

Welp, this past Sunday, I had my first official Kirk Cameron sighting. I was seated with my wife, the call to worship music just started when a glare of sun light caught my eye. I turned to the left, over my shoulder, and there he stood with a buddy. Bigger than life. They looked around for seats, made their way around the perimeter of the sanctuary and an usher sat them down right next to the deaf section in the front by the organ.

I jabbed my wife and said, "Lookit, Kirk Cameron."

So I guess he is real after all.



Blogger Nathan said...

I thought I saw him walk past me at church yesterday. I stopped, shook my head, and kept going. Nah.

Stoopid me.

7:51 AM, September 25, 2006  
Blogger Frank Martens said...

Hahaha... Ya seem a little too excited there.

Also wasn't Doogie Howzer, MD a 90s thing? However, I do know that Growing Pains was an 80s thing.

9:08 AM, September 25, 2006  
Blogger Steve P said...

I though Kirk Cameron (and his mentor Ray Comfort) were Arminian. Does this mean that he is turning 'reformed'?
Anyway, It's amazing to me that he still looks exactly the same as he did in the 80's.

10:00 AM, September 25, 2006  
Blogger thomas4881 said...

I've listened to a lot of Ray Comforts' audios at www.biblicalevangelism.com . I am a member of the evangelism school. I have read a few of Rays' books. He is more of a calminian. Though he has made it clear that no man can convert anyone. Ray said that it's the holy spirit that does the converting.

1:49 PM, September 25, 2006  
Blogger Fred Butler said...

I have never known Kirk as being Arminian, at least in the classic sense of the word. I guess now I may have a chance to ask him.

I am not a big fan of WOTM; I think they emphasize the law way too much to the exclusion of justification. Even so, I do appreciate what those guys are doing and watching their encounters with people on the street can be both informative and entertaining at the same time.


2:37 PM, September 25, 2006  
Blogger Joanna Martens said...

wow that's hardcore freddy. I met him when i worked at spirit west coast del mar a couple years back. He's one cool dude- i'll have to see if I can spot him when i'm in choir sometime...

and neither kirk nor ray are arminian. They just see spreading the gospel is important, we are all hopeless, helpless sinners, and the only way to heaven is through Jesus Christ.

3:49 PM, September 25, 2006  
Blogger Hayden said...


Are you sure this is not some conspiracy to distract you from all the "purpose driven" philosophy at GCC? Or how about a diversion from Al Mohler's involvment in the UN one world government? {{ Sarcasm dripping}}

It is good that Kirk has returned to the "mothership". (He used to attend GCC in the 90's from time to time)

Heather and I are praying for you and your treatments. Keep us up to date. Have you developed any cool superpowers yet?


8:37 PM, September 25, 2006  
Blogger Daniel said...

Sadly, Kirk has never attended our church, not even in the 90's.

I haven't followed Ray Comfort's ministry in a long time. I agree that Ray Comfort's ministry is focused on Evangelism, and Ray even says as much - he doesn't pretend to be a pastor, but an evangelist - and he seems to be a "position player" - which is okay by me. I wouldn't go to a church that was built around a sort of WOTM philosophy, but to be fair - I don't think Ray would either! At least the last time I checked (which was admittedly a long time ago) Ray wasn't trying to be a church or fill the spectrum, but was simply "running with the ball" according to his gifting, and the focus of his ministry therefore was (unapologetically) Evangelism.

I am probably naive, but I have no problem with a ministry that is focused on evangelism - so long as doesn't imagine itself to be anything more than it is.

I will step off the soap box now. ;-)

10:49 AM, September 27, 2006  
Blogger Steve P said...

Please understand that my first comment about Kirk Cameron being an Arminian wasn't meant to be a slam on Kirk (or Ray Comfort). I guess there should have been a "?" at the end of my sentence. I've gone and listened to a lot of TWOTM stuff and I think what they're doing is pretty cool. I agree with you though (Fred) that they seem to focus too much attention on the Law and not enough on what it means to be justified (And the workings of the Holy Spirit in bringing that about.) Their questions they ask (about the Law) seem like a good place to start though. (A good ice-breaker.)
As far as the whole Arminian, Calminian, Calvinist thing. I'm not really hearing much from them about God's Sovereignty, man's (sinful) free will, the fact that we inherited our sinfulness from Adam. Instead I'm hearing more "We die because we don't keep His Commandments" or "You need to do this" or "You need to do that". He even says (Ray Comfort) in one of his lessons that if anyone asks other questions, such as on predestination, election, evolution, or other topics, to redirect them back to the Law questions. Also, Kirk's association with Tim Lahaye (whom, no one will deny is anti-reformed). My point is that even Tim Lahaye and Dave Hunt say that no one can come to Christ without the work of the Holy Spirit, but they do not take that to its logical conclusion, which is Calvinism.
Don't get me wrong though, God is using this ministry (TWOTM) in a very special way, and I applaud them for what they do. Also Kirk (and Ray) seem like great guys.

I guess that was my soap box.
God Bless,

10:19 AM, September 28, 2006  
Blogger Fred Butler said...

I think I would probably agree with many of your concerns, because I see those things too. I think they use the law questions to the exclusion of other methods of approach when evangelizing. We don't see an exclusive use of the 10 commandments when the apostles evangelized in Acts. Paul, for example, never appealed to the 10 commandments when he engaged the gentiles in Acts 14 and on Mars Hill in Acts 17. His point of contact was their knowledge of a divine creator, which all men have, but suppress.

Though I like their tenacious boldness when they street evangelize, but anyone who has any bit of experience realizes that different starting points will need to be utilized with different audiences. We live in a postmodern, non-supernatual society who have very little knowledge or respect for the Bible. They could care less what the 10 commandments say, even if it is God saying it. To think that an exclusive appeal to the 10 commandments well be the "golden ticket" so to speak with convincing people for their need for Christ is a tad naive. That may not be Ray and Kirk's attitude to their approach, but I think some who use WOTM methodology believe it is.


11:24 AM, September 28, 2006  
Anonymous Anonymous said...

I think Ray has to be Reformed. I say this because I have read one of his books and I am currently studing their School of Biblical Evengelism with he is constantly quoting famous Calvinistic preachers: almost guilt by association!

Believe me, they do put emphasis on Justification by Faith, but their main ministry is trying to teach people to share the Gospel using the law, so I think they do it in such a way as not to be dragged into such things as Calvniism vs Arminianism.

IMHO, the "Way of the Master" method of evangelism is one of the best you can use.

3:51 AM, November 28, 2006  
Blogger John said...

What church do you go to? Grace Community?

11:44 PM, February 17, 2009  
Blogger Fred Butler said...

Yes, I go to Grace Community Church in Sun Valley (a suburb of LA).
John MacArthur is the pastor.

Since I wrote this, coming up to 3 years ago now, I haven't seen Kirk around like I use to. I think the last time I saw him was outside my 2nd oldest child's Sunday school room, and that was maybe last spring, 2008 or so.

I am not sure where Kirk goes to church now.

5:23 AM, February 18, 2009  

Post a Comment

Links to this post:

Create a Link

<< Home